A question for the ice cream flavorologists and Baitcon's hosts

[whuffle.livejournal.com]

Do we have a protocol for marking ice creams with possibly allergens or ingredients that some folks might want to avoid?

If I remeber correctly, there were some considerations of this subject after the 83? (or was it 86) flavors produced at the last Baitcon. Considering there are now some truly interesting flavors being explored, should we contemplate segregating flavors with known issues at their own table? Would it be best to put flavors with meat, seafood, alcohol, and nuts on their own table so folks who might be allergic or vegetarian could easily avoid them and not worry about scoop contamination?

I am actually asking because a number of my experimental flavors this year could qualify for these categories. I plan to make Ceviche Sorbet. Yes, the fish will be cooked to avoid possible illnesses associated with raw fish, but some people do NOT eat fish at all. Same is true of my Sweet Orange Tea Sorbet, into which I plan to put real ginger brandy. And the Cucumber Sorbet that I've been making for 4 years now will have Midori in it this year to attempt to avoid the problem of being rock-solid frozen.

I'm not advocating that we get out of hand about this, but at 83 flavors, it might finally be time to start intentional segregation rather than the usual table disersal system.

Thoughts anyone?

Comments

[skreeky]

Completely irrelevant to your question and merely out of my own curiosity, did you try vodka in the cucumber? Don't get me wrong, cucumber-midori sounds facinating and I will happily try it. I would just think vodka would interfere less with a delicate cucumber flavor.

I know nothing about making ice cream, so forgive any failure to grasp the obvious.

[whuffle.livejournal.com]

While I can get away with using a whole lot less vodka, the flavor is so sharp when its uncooked that it masks the cucumber more than Midori does. I'm actually still looking for alternatives to the Midori because it still doesn't work as well as I'd like. Since you have a good deal of exposure to unusual forms of alcohol, feel free to suggest some if you think of any that might work. I was considering a lemon-based flavor as well possibly. Maybe Limoncello?

[skreeky]

I know nothing of the infamous limoncello except that people seem to either love it or hate it. =) Strangely, a lot of Baitcon flavors fall into that category as well.

But let's see, what else would I pair with cucumber? There's always Zima, but that's already got a niche at Baitcon. White wine, but pick one that's light, herbal, and totally unoaked (sauvignon blanc can add interesting notes of lemongrass and dill). I'll let you know if inspiration saunters up and starts mackin' on me at the bar.

I'm still surprised that vodka overwhelms the cucumber that much, but I will note that the less expensive the vodka, the stronger the flavor. I can taste cheap vodka at 30 yards, but something Grey Goose or better lets the other flavors in your drink shine.

Pepsi Ice Cucumber

[deguspice.livejournal.com]

Thursday, June 14, 2007
You could try what these guys are doing.


http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/nb20070614a6.html

Pepsi Cucumber hits store shelves
The Associated Press

Consumers can stay cool as a cucumber this summer with Pepsi Ice Cucumber, a new soda based on the crisp green gourd.

The soft drink, which hit stores Tuesday, doesn't actually have any cucumber in it. Instead, artificial flavoring mimics "the refreshing taste of a fresh cucumber," said Aya Takemoto, spokeswoman of Japan's Pepsi distributor, Suntory Ltd.

[...]

[infinitehotel.livejournal.com]

I'm the last person entitled to comment (having made meat flavors) but the usual "hose out the bucket and dip the spoon in some water during serving" sanitation isn't going to work for folks with seafood allergies. (Me, and I think a few other folks.) At serving time, I can avoid the table that has the ceviche (or give it its own spoon, I suppose) but you may need to make some extra effort to clean the bucket/utensils you use in freezing or wind up contaminating a bunch of other batches.

[whuffle.livejournal.com]

I'm completely prepared to do that and usually expect to wash my own buckets with soap after my batches have been mixed simply as a matter of courtesy to those who are running the LN station.

[infinitehotel.livejournal.com]

Can't see a problem then. The serving is still an issue, but that's my own lookout. I can dodge what I can see; it's the hidden stuff that gets you. :)

[kimberlogic.livejournal.com]

There will likely be some dedicated color buckets for mixing and freezing and specific colored serving spoons plus very distinct serving table for these.

[kimberlogic.livejournal.com]

How to handle labeling & placement is about to be discussed amongst the BCC crew in preparation for this year's events, actually.

Some related things will stay the same - new flavors are automatically smaller batches and if we've got a LOT of folks wanting to make ice cream, we'll probably set an initial limit on how many flavors each person can freeze, to be sure that the LN2 lasts so that everyone who wants to make a flavor gets a chance to do so ... along with that are the questions of whether or not to get a 2nd tank. Having 83 flavors was great but having so much leftover ice cream was not.

[whuffle.livejournal.com]

Glad to know that this is part of the logistics. I'd be very interested in hearing the results. Please do post them when you get the chance so we know what to expect.

[kimberlogic.livejournal.com]

They will be posted in the ice cream section of the web page much closer to the event date and I'll mention those updates here. There will probably also be a sign or some reiteration on-site.

[feste-sylvain.livejournal.com]

Full-blown anaphylactic reaction to shellfish here. If proper anti-cross-contamination procedures are not followed, I will have to stop eating ice cream completely that night.

Likewise, if there are buckets with shellfish and they are not sufficiently labelled, I will not participate.

I would be disappointed if that were the case, but I will not "require" that the crowd cater to my needs. I only need to know what the situation is.

[whuffle.livejournal.com]

Knowing that shellfish are a very common allergen, I don't plan to use any form of shellfish in the Ceviche. My plan was to do a white-fish only mixture with either flounder, cod, or tillapia.

[halleyscomet.livejournal.com]

I wonder how many people have a "Full-blown anaphylactic reaction" to one of the common ingredients.

Would it be worth while to make an "Extra care taken" set of flavors where extra hygiene and sanitation measures are taken to prevent such cross-contamination? Would it even be possible under the circumstances?

[jbsegal.livejournal.com]

Epinephrine Ripple!

Benadryl Brickle!

[sunspiral.livejournal.com]

As one of the more experimental ice cream makers, I think having an "extra scrubbing required" bucket for mixing the potentially dangerous flavors (habaneros, seafood, etc.) is a really good idea. And along with the bucket there should be posted a scrubbing protocol to keep people safe. Likewise, putting all of those flavors on their own table and clearly marked might work well too. Baitcon isn't improved by medical emergencies, or even by the delicate of palate having a misadventure with Habanero Surprise.

I can see it now - "Hey, that's a Red Pail flavor!"

[infinitehotel.livejournal.com]

It might be worth doing a separate serving for the really experimental stuff rather than doing it during the Saturday Riot. That'd allow folks to be more leisurely about taking their servings and most of the really experimental ice creams don't work well in the same bowl with anything else anyway. (With the possible exception of the chicken-liver/caramelized onion blend which was lovely.)

[sunspiral.livejournal.com]

Having a separate tasting session for the really experimental flavors could be a good idea, definitely one worth discussing. And yes, the chicken liver and caramelized onion ice creams did work well together.

[donnad.livejournal.com]

I like this idea!

[whuffle.livejournal.com]

As one who is becoming a more experimental ice cream flavor perpetrator, I heartily agree.

Perhaps Red should be for the hot and spicy flavors, Blue should be used for meat or fish flavors, and Yellow or Panic Orange should be reserved for flavors containing common allergens. And I would also give a huge nod to the idea that segregating those flavors at their own table is an idea who's time has come. I would say that spicy flavors are not something we should segregate for, since there are a lot of them and relatively few people who object or can't recognize them by names containing the words Chilli, Cayenne, or Pepper.

So, you gonna try some of the Ceviche or the Herb Cream Cheese if I manage to perfect a reasonable recipe?

[sunspiral.livejournal.com]

The Ceviche I'm looking forward to, the Herb Cream Cheese is not Scott Food.

[donnad.livejournal.com]

I am all for segregating meat based flavors from others. That means fishy based flavors too. G is also highly shellfish allergic.

I don't do the more savory flavors myself. The thought of a fish or meat flavored ice cream makes me want to gag.

I think the idea of a separate serving for savory flavors is a good idea. Maybe a mid afternoon or right before dinner (or with dinner) serving, some of the more savory flavors sound like they would be better as/with a meal rather than as a dessert.

[vvalkyri.livejournal.com]

Savory flavors with dinner does sound like a good plan. I remember the horseradish (horsey sauce not shredded) ice cream being very good with roast beef.

[quietann.livejournal.com]

Agreed completely on meat-based and savory flavors. And I will say no more, because last time I did, I just p*ssed off a bunch of folks.

[donnad.livejournal.com]

because last time I did, I just p*ssed off a bunch of folks.
Uh yup...Same here, when I tried to start a similar conversation I got shot down. I actually deleted my first comment here before posting it because I was afraid of it happening again.

I think I'm going to stick to my usual boring flavors like cranberry, key lime and mandarin ginger and maybe honey vanilla or yucky chocolate.